VAL Digest V1 #80

VAL Digest          Friday, November 28 2003          Volume 01 : Number 080




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Topics in Today's Digest:

Re: [VAL] Re:suburban furnace
Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #78
Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest
Re: [VAL] winter battery storage
Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #78
Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #78
[VAL] New from factory or new to you
RE: [VAL] New from factory or new to you
Re: [VAL] winter battery storage

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 00:45:50 -0500
From: gillguy@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re:suburban furnace

Alan
A few years ago I had a similar problem that drove me nuts.
I took it apart and thought I cleaned everything, checked everything, just
everything possible.
Still, same problem. Finally I took it to a guy that works on RV's, but not an
SOB dealership, local guy that has good comments from other customers. Having
an Airstream I was hesitant, but finally relented and took it to him. Picked
it up later that day and it's worked like a charm ever since. He cleaned it,
got more stuff out than I did, adjusted something  and fixed. Guess it's one
of those experience things, but the guy is good. I'd probably try to find
someone in your area that could fix it. Oh it cost me $50.00.
Expensive if your buying aspirin, but I don't have to put up with the headache
of troubleshooting it anymore.
Bobby Gill
Valdosta, GA
  ----- Original Message -----
  Wrom: SQHYUCDDJBLVLMHAALPT
      The unit fan never shuts off. The pilot does stay lit. Once the
  thermostat signals the furnace to shut down, the fan stays on. To get the
  furnace to
  fire back up I have to push the Reset plunger. When the Reset is complete
the
  furnace comes back on and we start all over again.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 00:35:49 -0500
From: gillguy@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #78

    Hello Faith
    Hope all is well.
    Wal-Mart has the RV anti-freeze. It's pink and comes in a a gallon
container.
To get it in the water lines some people disconnect the inlet side of the
fresh water tank pump
and insert a hose into the anti-freeze and then pump it into the system that
way.
    To me that's to much trouble. Open the water drain valve's that are by the
fresh water tank.
Also drain the water heater. Once all that's done simply pour the anti-freeze
into your fresh water tank.
Then you will want to turn on the water pump (switch on the control panel),
this will pump the anti-freeze into the lines once you turn on each faucet
that you want the anti-freeze in.
    I forget exactly how much you can dilute the anti-freeze down with water
(or even if you can) but I'm sure it will tell you on the container. Also
before you use the water system for drinking you will need to flush all the
lines out.
The anti-freeze taste bad. I don't use it. We like to camp in the winter too.
    What I do is drain all the water lines, then I take a air fitting (tire
valve) that I have on a piece of water hose that I can attach to my fresh
water connection, then I take and pressurize the system about 50-60 PSI and
have my wife open each faucet one at a time to remove the water. I don't know
if I get it all but I haven't had any problems doing it this way. Of course we
don't get the cold weather like you all do in the Ozarks. Also you can leave
the heat on about 50-60 and leave the cabinet doors open so the warm air gets
in there too.
Take care. Tell Frank hello too
Bobby Gill
Valdosta, GA
  ----- Original Message -----
  Wrom: JVZCMHVIBGDADRZF


  ANTI-FREEZE
    We have it heated inside with a small radiation heater but I imagine the
pipes
  still need to have some protection.
    Could you please tell me the type to use, how much, and where to put it
in
  at? It is so lovely and
  eventually, I'm going to get to go camping, God willing.
  Faith Navarro
  -----

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 00:54:16 -0500
From: gillguy@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest

Is it the 7.3 Diesel?
Also there is a 1973/74 31 footer for sale in my area, asking price $4500.00
Don't know what it's like but if any one is interested let me know and I'll go
check it out.

Bobby Gill
229-460-5195
Valdosta, GA
  ----- Original Message -----
  Wrom: IYZUNNYCGPKYLEJ
  To: valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com
  Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2003 5:23 PM
  Subject: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest


  Hello:

  I am looking seriously into purchasing a  1981 Excella 28' Airstream Motor
  Home .Any idea of prices of value for this model/year.
  Could any of you give me some pointers of what to look for?What are some
  things that I need to know?
  I need help to make a decision on this purchase.
  Thanks for any info and prices.
  David
  jdturner@xxxxxxxxxx.net

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 01:05:26 -0500
From: gillguy@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: Re: [VAL] winter battery storage

Joe
I have had several  trailers that I've not put a battery in.
I've also only had to replace a converter once. That was on the trailer we now
have that was supposed to be in great A #1 shape, all systems perfect.
What a line of crap. Oh well everything works great now and we like it. Just
need to install those dang bunks.

Bobby Gill
Valdosta, GA
  ----- Original Message -----
  Wrom: CONEUQZAAFXISH
  To: valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com
  Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 3:55 PM
  Subject: [VAL] winter battery storage


  A question for the group. Living in warm and delightful Wyoming causes me to
wonder if I should remove my battery for the winter. It has already gotten
down to 17 below here, I am sure that even colder weather is in our future.
Will it do the trailer any harm if I plug it in to 120 when there is no
battery?
    Joe

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 08:19:57 -0700
From: "Roger Hightower" <rwhigh@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #78

gillguy@xxxxxxxxxx.com said "Once all that's done simply pour the anti-freeze into
your fresh water tank."

You can never completely drain the fresh water tank, and you'll taste the
anti-freeze all year.  Use the water pump to get the anti-freeze into the
system, and when you flush it out, it's gone.

Roger

Roger Hightower
WBCCI #4165,VAC
1975 31' Sovereign
Mesa, AZ

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 11:56:07 -0500
From: "Jim Greene" <drgreene@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #78

I agree, Roger. Your fresh water will have the antifreeze taste a   l o n g
time  if it's put in the fresh water tank. It's not hard to disconnect the
inlet water line to the pump and use the pump to push antifreeze through the
lines. My 24' Tradewind takes about 1 gal of antifreeze since I have
installed a water heater bypass available at RV stores. Pays for itself the
first year. My first Airstream back in the 70s had a low spot in the water
line and blowing the lines out with compressed air didn't get all the water
out. The water froze and split the line in an inaccessible place (naturally)
and would have cost a lot to have it repaired. It took a lot of time and
sweat effort to fix it myself and I promised myself I would not have frozen
split lines again. And I haven't.

Jim Greene
' 68 Tradewind

- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Roger Hightower" <rwhigh@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
To: <valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 10:19 AM
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #78


> gillguy@xxxxxxxxxx.com said "Once all that's done simply pour the anti-freeze
into
> your fresh water tank."
>
> You can never completely drain the fresh water tank, and you'll taste the
> anti-freeze all year.  Use the water pump to get the anti-freeze into the
> system, and when you flush it out, it's gone.
>
> Roger
>
> Roger Hightower
> WBCCI #4165,VAC
> 1975 31' Sovereign
> Mesa, AZ
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text
>
> To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
> http://www.tompatterson.com/VAC/VAList/listoffice.html

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 17:04:31 -0500
From: Terry Tyler <tylerbears@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: [VAL] New from factory or new to you

on 11/24/2003 9:22:26 PM, n9yay@xxxxxxxxxx.com wrote:
> 
> What I am looking for and debating against is either a vintage and working to
> remodel/restore it or buying a new 25' safari. I would appreciate any
> assistance from the list. You may email me privately if you wish.
> 

Hi Rich,

If you aren't thrilled by purchasing gobs of depreciation but you are turned
on by getting top value for the money you've saved/earned over the years,
then a few weeks of homework (archives are a source) and persistence in
searching (looking at a minimum of a dozen) will provide the best chances of
finding a Vintage rig in like-new condition or perhaps fully restored or
perhaps one that's been sitting in a barn for 15 years. Granted, you might
hesitate to pay top dollar for one of these, but there's a profound
difference between what a Vintage Airstream costs and what a brand new
Airstream costs. Duh - what's my point?

To my way of thinking, buyers with the two traits of knowledge and
persistence have the best chance of saving the most money AND having the
most money in their wallets to spend after they become new owners. It's
difficult for me to understand why there's so much I've got to know before I
know how little I know, but that happens.

Then - there are those buyers who want whatever it is that sparks their
fancy - right now - at whatever they think is a bargain price - without
doing the homework. That style of buying was never one of my aspirations.

Other concepts in the mix are the subtle variables that few Airstreamers
talk about in public; like the difference in skin thickness (by year of
manufacture) when it comes to damage which can be caused by hail stones; or
the difference in weight of materials (by year of manufacture) used for
cupboards, lockers and refrigerator doors; or knowing which years the
factory used particle board instead of plywood on the floor; or which years
they offered thermopane windows: or the Everpure QC2 water filter; or had
high road clearance (for off road use); and the list goes on and on.  What
ever priority level a buyer has for specific features will inevitably be
factored in - by intent or not (whether they know it or don't have a clue).

When you mentioned remodel / restore, a third concept came to mind. It's
called "upgrade." 

For example, a fantastic fan in one (or both) of the roof vents; a separate
coax line for the satellite receiver; an amplifier for the television
antenna; a switch to swap between the satellite signal and the local TV's
station signal (for weather reports during tornado season); an automatic
starter for the hot water heater; back up lights; a pressure bladder in the
water system so the pump doesn't come during the night; a higher grade of
carpeting (or perhaps wood floor in the kitchen); a tiny solar panel on top
of the fridge vent to operate a small cooling fan behind the fridge on those
hot sultry days when the fridge can't keep up; a catalytic heater; solar
panels; a third battery; a cube heater; a hanging toaster oven; or; or...

So what's my point? Installation of upgrades is not rocket science. I
believe the cost of upgrades wanted by most buyers doesn't even come close
to the amount of depreciation purchased by buyers of brand new Airstreams.
On top of that, the interest charged on the monthly payments is money spent
which didn't buy one single upgrade nor one piece of optional equipment.

Having said all this, if buying a new Airstream and having RV payments is
the preferred style, then it's still necessary to deal with ordinary
problems experienced by owners of new vehicles. Mechanical devices need
maintenance or repair or replacement based on their use or non-use and the
soundness of their design. I believe the best chance of getting a new
Airstream with design flaws is when new features or new models are
introduced. The only way to know when this possibility exists is to have
done the homework. 

Regardless of whether I've purchased new or used, I've always had a "to do"
list of jobs requiring maintenance, repair or replacement. On those
occasions when I didn't buy depreciation (when I bought used), I've had more
money in the bank for the other things in life we enjoy.  That pleases me.

Bottom line, everyone is different and my opinions belong only to me. The
real decisions are based on the buyer's needs, wants, wishes, goals, talents
and skills (developed or dormant), and perhaps - what the spouse dictates.

Terry
1967 22' Safari
1989 32' Excella

"Whoever buys has need of a hundred eyes. But one's enough to sell the
stuff."

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 22:00:10 -0500
From: "Edward Emerick" <EEMERICK@xxxxxxxxxx.rr.com>
Subject: RE: [VAL] New from factory or new to you

Hello Rich,
I have two OLD Airstreams, 68 and 59, the 68 is finished and the 59 is
on its way. I have enjoyed reworking both coaches, the 68 just needed
all the systems updated (fridge, water heater, AC, vents, tires, brakes,
fresh water tank etc) and the 59 is a gutted job. I have written out a
list of what you can expect to find with a use unit, if you contact me
off list I will send you these words of wisdom?! The bottom line is if
you go used get ready to replace parts, spend some $$ and expect to
donate some blood along the way. Like I said I have enjoyed my journey
but it would take some talking to get me to do it again. We have talked
of owning a new CCD and to be honest that will be the next coach that
joins the fleet. Each his own on the financial side, I'll never get out
of what I have in the two trailers and depreciation on a new one won't
be recovered for many years. Most important, it's a HOBBY, cost don't
count and investments are for Wall Street types
Ed
WBCCI/VAC 4425
68 Sovereign
59 Traveler
eemerick@xxxxxxxxxx.rr.com

- -----Original Message-----
From: valist-admin@xxxxxxxxxx.com
[mailto:valist-admin@xxxxxxxxxx.com] On Behalf Of Terry Tyler
Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 5:05 PM
To: AirstreamList@xxxxxxxxxx.com; valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: [VAL] New from factory or new to you


on 11/24/2003 9:22:26 PM, n9yay@xxxxxxxxxx.com wrote:
> 
> What I am looking for and debating against is either a vintage and 
> working to remodel/restore it or buying a new 25' safari. I would 
> appreciate any assistance from the list. You may email me privately if

> you wish.
> 

Hi Rich,

If you aren't thrilled by purchasing gobs of depreciation but you are
turned on by getting top value for the money you've saved/earned over
the years, then a few weeks of homework (archives are a source) and
persistence in searching (looking at a minimum of a dozen) will provide
the best chances of finding a Vintage rig in like-new condition or
perhaps fully restored or perhaps one that's been sitting in a barn for
15 years. Granted, you might hesitate to pay top dollar for one of
these, but there's a profound difference between what a Vintage
Airstream costs and what a brand new Airstream costs. Duh - what's my
point?

To my way of thinking, buyers with the two traits of knowledge and
persistence have the best chance of saving the most money AND having the
most money in their wallets to spend after they become new owners. It's
difficult for me to understand why there's so much I've got to know
before I know how little I know, but that happens.

Then - there are those buyers who want whatever it is that sparks their
fancy - right now - at whatever they think is a bargain price - without
doing the homework. That style of buying was never one of my
aspirations.

Other concepts in the mix are the subtle variables that few Airstreamers
talk about in public; like the difference in skin thickness (by year of
manufacture) when it comes to damage which can be caused by hail stones;
or the difference in weight of materials (by year of manufacture) used
for cupboards, lockers and refrigerator doors; or knowing which years
the factory used particle board instead of plywood on the floor; or
which years they offered thermopane windows: or the Everpure QC2 water
filter; or had high road clearance (for off road use); and the list goes
on and on.  What ever priority level a buyer has for specific features
will inevitably be factored in - by intent or not (whether they know it
or don't have a clue).

When you mentioned remodel / restore, a third concept came to mind. It's
called "upgrade." 

For example, a fantastic fan in one (or both) of the roof vents; a
separate coax line for the satellite receiver; an amplifier for the
television antenna; a switch to swap between the satellite signal and
the local TV's station signal (for weather reports during tornado
season); an automatic starter for the hot water heater; back up lights;
a pressure bladder in the water system so the pump doesn't come during
the night; a higher grade of carpeting (or perhaps wood floor in the
kitchen); a tiny solar panel on top of the fridge vent to operate a
small cooling fan behind the fridge on those hot sultry days when the
fridge can't keep up; a catalytic heater; solar panels; a third battery;
a cube heater; a hanging toaster oven; or; or...

So what's my point? Installation of upgrades is not rocket science. I
believe the cost of upgrades wanted by most buyers doesn't even come
close to the amount of depreciation purchased by buyers of brand new
Airstreams. On top of that, the interest charged on the monthly payments
is money spent which didn't buy one single upgrade nor one piece of
optional equipment.

Having said all this, if buying a new Airstream and having RV payments
is the preferred style, then it's still necessary to deal with ordinary
problems experienced by owners of new vehicles. Mechanical devices need
maintenance or repair or replacement based on their use or non-use and
the soundness of their design. I believe the best chance of getting a
new Airstream with design flaws is when new features or new models are
introduced. The only way to know when this possibility exists is to have
done the homework. 

Regardless of whether I've purchased new or used, I've always had a "to
do" list of jobs requiring maintenance, repair or replacement. On those
occasions when I didn't buy depreciation (when I bought used), I've had
more money in the bank for the other things in life we enjoy.  That
pleases me.

Bottom line, everyone is different and my opinions belong only to me.
The real decisions are based on the buyer's needs, wants, wishes, goals,
talents and skills (developed or dormant), and perhaps - what the spouse
dictates.

Terry
1967 22' Safari
1989 32' Excella

"Whoever buys has need of a hundred eyes. But one's enough to sell the
stuff."

- -----------------------------------------------------------------
When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text

To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 22:55:04 -0700
From: "gshippen" <gshippen@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Subject: Re: [VAL] winter battery storage

Joe,

I left the battery in the Overlander while plugged in for many winters.
However I found that the water soon disappeared out of the battery which
lead to its eventual demise.  So lately I have been removing it and storing
it down in the basement for the winter.  As you probably know we go through
more auto batteries in Wyoming than the folks in warmer climates.  But that
is the price we pay to live next to great camping like Yellowstone Park.
Good luck, GAS
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Winkler" <joepatwink@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
To: <valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 1:55 PM
Subject: [VAL] winter battery storage


> A question for the group. Living in warm and delightful Wyoming causes me
to wonder if I should remove my battery for the winter. It has already
gotten down to 17 below here, I am sure that even colder weather is in our
future. Will it do the trailer any harm if I plug it in to 120 when there is
no battery?
>   Joe
>
> __________________________________________________________________
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today!
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>
> To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
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------------------------------

End of VAL Digest V1 #80
************************


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