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VAL Digest V1 #351



VAL Digest          Thursday, August 26 2004          Volume 01 : Number 351




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Topics in Today's Digest:

Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!
Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!
Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!
[VAL] Protecting the polish job
Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!
RE: [VAL] Protecting the polish job
Re: [VAL] Protecting the polish job
[VAL] best tow vehicle
[VAL] Re: warped rotors
Re: [VAL] Protecting the polish job

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Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 08:05:07 EDT
From: Imp67cc64@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!

Paul,
Thanks for the insight.  I guess I am totally frustrated with Ford's 
unwillingness to deal with the problem and keep a satisfied customer.  Previously I 
had a 2001 Suburban that burned 2 qts of oil in the first 4000 miles; not only 
did Chevrolet fix the problem without questions, they sent me a letter about a 
month later telling me they had extended my drivetrain warranty to 100,000 
miles.  That is the customer service that the manufacturers should be giving if 
they believe in their products.

John


In a message dated 8/24/2004 11:13:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
Balloon@xxxxxxxxxx.com writes:

> The problem you speak about is a common problem on both the
> Excursion and the F250/350 SD. They will replace the rotors if
> you b*tch enough. I had the same problem, only after telling them
> I would ride the brakes all the way home then drive it into the river
> to bend the rotors like a paperclip, did they replace them. Just to
> let you know, even after replacment, the "factory" rotors will warp
> again. The best thing you can do is go with a good after market. They
> make highpro rotors for both. All vehicles have there problems, its
> just a question of which ones do you want to deal with??

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 08:08:53 EDT
From: Imp67cc64@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!

In a message dated 8/24/2004 11:07:01 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
dean@xxxxxxxxxx.net writes:

> Warping rotors ... sounds like a miss installed tire..
> When they install your lug nuts they need to be put on easy all around.
> Then cross tightened up to the correct ft/lbs .
> Check some other place that has an older, more experienced tech.
> 

If this is the case, it would have been the Ford service dept that replaced 
the original tires with new due to a  tire recall.

John 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 08:11:11 -0500
From: <Balloon@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!

Tom,

Maybe. On my 2000, 250SD 7.3, 4X4, I have an extra set that I keep
freshly turned becuase they keep warping. I also have a 2001 Excursion
7.3, that has 48K and have not had a problem. If you go out on the
different "powerstroke" email list, you will find people have had problems
with both. Some say its the way the wheels are tighten up, over tighten,
not tighten in the right order, etc... So will you have problems?? Maybe!
You would think it would always be the front, not so. I had lots of problems
with the back ones on the truck. It just comes down to, some do and some
don't.

Paul


- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tom" <thomm@xxxxxxxxxx.rr.com>
To: <valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:35 PM
Subject: Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!


> I've got a Ford 2001 Excursion 4x4 Power Stroke Diesel.  You say I'm going
> to have a problem with *my* brake rotors?  Why's that?
>
> Tom
> WBCCI 5303
>
>
> Subject: Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!
>
>
> > The problem you speak about is a common problem on both the
> > Excursion and the F250/350 SD. They will replace the rotors if
> > you b*tch enough. I had the same problem, only after telling them
> > I would ride the brakes all the way home then drive it into the river
> > to bend the rotors like a paperclip, did they replace them. Just to
> > let you know, even after replacment, the "factory" rotors will warp
> > again. The best thing you can do is go with a good after market. They
> > make highpro rotors for both. All vehicles have there problems, its
> > just a question of which ones do you want to deal with??
> >
> > Paul Waddell
> > WBCCI/VAC/WDCU 1270>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text
>
> To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
> http://www.tompatterson.com/VAC/VAList/listoffice.html

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Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 09:04:42 -0700
From: "C. Hale" <chale@xxxxxxxxxx.ca>
Subject: [VAL] Protecting the polish job

Hi all,
Well I'm polishing like crazy on my 59 Traveler again.  And I'm really
trying to find out what might be good follow up for protecting that
shine when this round is complete.  I'm using Nuvite polish and it's
beautiful.  The shine doesn't last long, I think because it's stored in
an open ended "carport" type structure (heavy tubing covered with heavy
"tarp-type" material) and still receives a lot of weather.  I'm
interested in some final finish to help the shine job stand up to that
weather.  I am working on closing in one end of the cover structure but
that will take a while.  
I would appreciate any suggestions/experiences along these lines that
you might offer, either here on the list or to my email address.
Thank you.
Cindy

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Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:52:12 -0400
From: "Tom" <thomm@xxxxxxxxxx.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!

Is that how long you've had a problem -- since they replaced the recalled 
Firestone Load Range D tires with Load Range E tires?  You never rotated or 
took off the wheels before then?  If not ?

Tom


Subject: Re: [VAL] Tow Vehicle --dont forget about the brakes!!!


> If this is the case, it would have been the Ford service dept that 
> replaced
> the original tires with new due to a  tire recall.
>
> John 

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Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:01:18 -0500
From: "dtidmore" <dtidmore@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Subject: RE: [VAL] Protecting the polish job

Cindy,
Herb Spies, who has his '63 Globetrotter polished to an unbelievable mirror
finish has been pleased with NuFinish (orange bottle liquid).  He says that
it does NOT dull the shine like lots of others and he has been pleased with
the way it protects and lasts.

david

- -----Original Message-----
From: valist-admin@xxxxxxxxxx.com [mailto:valist-admin@xxxxxxxxxx.com]
On Behalf Of C. Hale
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 11:05 AM
To: Airstream Yahoo list; valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: [VAL] Protecting the polish job

Hi all,
Well I'm polishing like crazy on my 59 Traveler again.  And I'm really
trying to find out what might be good follow up for protecting that
shine when this round is complete.  I'm using Nuvite polish and it's
beautiful.  The shine doesn't last long, I think because it's stored in
an open ended "carport" type structure (heavy tubing covered with heavy
"tarp-type" material) and still receives a lot of weather.  I'm
interested in some final finish to help the shine job stand up to that
weather.  I am working on closing in one end of the cover structure but
that will take a while.  
I would appreciate any suggestions/experiences along these lines that
you might offer, either here on the list or to my email address.
Thank you.
Cindy

- -----------------------------------------------------------------
When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:21:44 -0500 (CDT)
From: balloon@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: Re: [VAL] Protecting the polish job

You may want to check with the guys at P&S in Ohio.
The son just polished his 64 Overlander and I thought
he told me that he was trying out some type wax to
help keep the look longer.

Paul Waddell
WBCCI/VAC/WDCU 1270

> Hi all,
> Well I'm polishing like crazy on my 59 Traveler again.  And I'm really
> trying to find out what might be good follow up for protecting that
> shine when this round is complete.  I'm using Nuvite polish and it's
> beautiful.  The shine doesn't last long, I think because it's stored in
> an open ended "carport" type structure (heavy tubing covered with heavy
> "tarp-type" material) and still receives a lot of weather.  I'm
> interested in some final finish to help the shine job stand up to that
> weather.  I am working on closing in one end of the cover structure but
> that will take a while.
> I would appreciate any suggestions/experiences along these lines that
> you might offer, either here on the list or to my email address.
> Thank you.
> Cindy
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text
>
> To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
> http://www.tompatterson.com/VAC/VAList/listoffice.html

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:05:44 -0600
From: "Randy Unter" <runter@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: [VAL] best tow vehicle

Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 13:17:09 -0400
From: "Tom" <thomm@xxxxxxxxxx.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [VAL] best tow vehicle

Randy,

A Mercury Mountaineer is equivalent to what in the Ford stable?

Tom

Tom, the Ford Explorer, Mercury Mountaineer, and Lincoln Aviator (EMA) use
essentially the same chasis, with the Explorer and Mountaineer using the
same power train. Even the interiors are the same. The only real difference
is exterior body panels. The Mountaineer  is only available as an AWD for
4wd, the Explorer offers PT and Auto 4WD, and AWD as options. Mercury
packages everything together. Most of the models sold in Denver are 4.6 Ltr
V8's with AWD and Leather interior. I think the key factor that makes these
vehicles tow so well for their size is their 5 speed automatic
transmissions. They have two 2nd gears-one for economy,  a lower one for
pulling/acceleration. This allows the engine  to stay in the torque band
when accelerating, or downshifting. When I compared the EMA to the 5.4 ltr
Expedition with 4-speed, the Expedition was sluggish by comparison.
I did extensive analysis of the different tow vehicles with a complete
indifference to brand name. What I considered in order was:
1. Safety-Government and Insurance institute crash test results. Had to be 4
star or better.
2. Performance- Acceleration: 0-60 mph < 8.0 seconds; braking: 60-0 mph <
130 feet; slalom speed (speed through cones to test lane change and agility>
55 mph; turning radius < 38 feet; fuel type-regular; Fuel mileage > 15 mpg
city, > 18 mpg highway. ( I was coming out of a performance Volvo and wanted
near sport sedan like performance that I could park in tight, urban parking
structures)
3. Operating cost- I only wanted to pay for gas and nothing else. Ford
rolled a maintenance package into the lease for $20/month, less than half of
what it would have costed if I paid for routine maintence. I pay for nothing
else except tires which should last 50k miles.
4. Reliability- After my high-cost Volvo experiences, I didn't want any
hassles. Checking with Consumer Reports and friends who owned them for
highly reliable vehicles.
5. Towing- > 7000 #'s.
6. List price- under $40K

Applying this criteria netted only  3 vehicles, although I tested the Tahoe
and Denali (GMC).  The Tahoe met the criteria except for braking. I don't
understand why GM continues to make 1/2 trucks with marginal brakes (I've
owned 5 of them).
The Denali is a fabulous vehicle, meeting my criteria except it costs +$50K.
So that left only the EMA three, however, the Aviator is $50K loaded up.
Also, I found the Aviator was not much difference in performance over the E
and M, even though it sports a 32 valve version of the 4.6 ltr. V8 and a
trick computer controlled suspension.
I chose the Mountaineer over the Explorer stricly for cosmetic reasons and
local dealer who "dealt". The Explorer would have been fine as well for the
same price.
I would suggest that others use a similar evaluation scheme when seeking a
tow vehicle to sort through the dozens of vehicles before setting foot on a
dealers lot. I have found that salesmen at car dealerships really don't know
the types of information I presented above and are selling hype and emotion.
So be armed and you will wind up with a vehicle you will enjoy down the
road. I have used the criteria for the last 4 vehicle acquitions, and have
been satisfied with all of the purchases. I only drive those vehicles that
meet or nearly meet the criteria.
Randy

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 11:12:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: jon fitz <fitzjo1@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Subject: [VAL] Re: warped rotors

I had an 84 Volvo DL that was actually an oversized
rotor-warping apparatus disguised as a car.  It may be
that you have some other problem--but it is certainly
possible that the factory rotors are a flawed design,
as someone else has suggested.  I put a couple of sets
of rotors on the Volvo myself and was careful about
the torque and sequencing of the lug nuts.  It didn't
matter.  After about 6 months, they would be warped
again.  I researched it on the net and it turns out
this is a common problem for that car.  It sounds like
the same might be true of your Excursion.

If you are handy, you may find that the rotors aren't
too hard to replace yourself.  I know that's
aggravating, but could be an option later on if you
wish to keep the vehicle.

BTW--I doubt that your limited towing has anything to
do with the warped rotors and wouldn't mention that
unless specifically asked.  It has been my experience
that such information is often used as a convenient
excuse by dealers who don't want to be bothered with
customer service.

Jon in SC
68 Overlander


		
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Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 13:11:31 -0600
From: "Kenneth E. Johansen" <johansen@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Protecting the polish job

I use Rollite sealer - seems to work well.  P&S clearcoats their trailers, 
so would be a different type of polish/wax/sealer

Ken


At 09:04 AM 08/25/04 -0700, you wrote:
>Hi all,
>Well I'm polishing like crazy on my 59 Traveler again.  And I'm really
>trying to find out what might be good follow up for protecting that
>shine when this round is complete.  I'm using Nuvite polish and it's
>beautiful.  The shine doesn't last long, I think because it's stored in
>an open ended "carport" type structure (heavy tubing covered with heavy
>"tarp-type" material) and still receives a lot of weather.  I'm
>interested in some final finish to help the shine job stand up to that
>weather.  I am working on closing in one end of the cover structure but
>that will take a while.
>I would appreciate any suggestions/experiences along these lines that
>you might offer, either here on the list or to my email address.
>Thank you.
>Cindy
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text
>
>To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
>http://www.tompatterson.com/VAC/VAList/listoffice.html

------------------------------

End of VAL Digest V1 #351
*************************


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