VAL Digest V1 #289

VAL Digest            Friday, June 25 2004            Volume 01 : Number 289




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Topics in Today's Digest:

[VAL] Incredibley stupid mistake
Re: [VAL] Incredibley stupid mistake
[VAL] Re: Awning
[VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #288
Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #288
[VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .
RE: [VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .
RE: [VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .
Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #288
Re: [VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .
Re: [VAL] Re: Door Hinge Question

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Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 19:05:58 -0400
From: Daisy Welch <jtdjtd@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: [VAL] Incredibley stupid mistake

I am in Geneva NY, left MA this morning.

I can't find my entry ticket.

What should I do ?

Daisy

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 08:41:43 -0400
From: "Scott Scheuermann" <s.l.scheuermann@xxxxxxxxxx.att.net>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Incredibley stupid mistake

Good question Daisy!

I'm sure that you are not the first one that this has happened to. Continue
on to Lansing and don't  worry about it, just expect a hard time at the
registration table!

Scott

- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Daisy Welch" <jtdjtd@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
To: "VAL list" <valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com>; <AirstreamList@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2004 7:05 PM
Subject: [VAL] Incredibley stupid mistake


> I am in Geneva NY, left MA this morning.
>
> I can't find my entry ticket.
>
> What should I do ?
>
> Daisy

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 10:11:55 EDT
From: AlanTBird@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: [VAL] Re: Awning

Hey ALL!
I spent the last year or so dealing with most of the issues on this thread!
My 74 safari just had the rail. A friend gave me a new manual awning with 
poles that had a vinyl rod that slid along the rail. I believe he said he got it 
from JC Whitney.
Used it twice and then sold the trailer. It was a pain in the @$$ to put up 
and take down!
Definitely was a two person job! It was not a simple task to slide it and 
keep it aligned at the same time.

The Argosy came with the rail only and I called what I thought was a local 
A/S dealer to see about a ZIPP DEE as I had two A/Ss with one and loved them 
both!
The dealer talked me into a Carefree and I am really not very happy with it!
The install was a nightmare and after two return visits it is still not 
closing properly.
I spent the money and now I'm stuck with it!
I wont publicly SLAM a business but if anyone in the PHX area wants to 
contact me off list ~ I can give them the heads up on who it was. They no longer 
sell A/S and after what I went through they wont get a referral from me!


AlanT
Phx AZ
78 Arg. 30
93 Dodge Cummins

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 10:40:16 EDT
From: MaryDotson@xxxxxxxxxx.com
Subject: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #288

Thanks to all for the suggestions on the interior paint removal and the  
upper cabinets.  I will be doing a work weekend on our darlin' toaster this  
weekend, so I will report back about the results.
 
As for awning, we have a similar case of  former zipdeeitis.  I am going to 
go the dirt cheap and lazy way,  since spening $500+ for a custom job is just 
too much for a  rather optional item.  
 
At Home Depot, I bought two painters tarps (plan to use  only one--keep the 
other for paint removal inside).  Most tarps there  are heavy rough canvas, but 
the ones I bought are both white, of a  lighter weight but finer grade 
canvas.  My biggest choice is picking which  one--one is backed with rubber.  
However, having looked at a vintage awning  (belonging to a friend who has a canned 
ham) the not-backed one feels like the  vintage one.  I opened the cloth one 
up--and to my delight I found that  they flat felled the seams joining the 
selvages of the fabric!  However,  there was also a big dirty footprint in the 
middle, so I'm planning to wash it  (anyhow, it needs to be pre-shrunk).  Then I 
plan to sew a piece of rope  into the end, like welting or piping.  In the 
vintage ones, this fit into  the awning channel. For poles, I have ordered a 
bunch of retractable poles  from _www.campmor.com_ (http://www.campmor.com) .  I 
will sew a  bit of heavier canvas at the stake-out points as reinforcement, 
then pound in  big brass grommets for pole insertion at those points.
 
 I'll also seam a channel in the front and sides (leaving a bit  to flop down 
as valance), to insert lateral reinforcement poles (in the vintage  one, this 
stoped it from slumping down at the sides).  Then I will miter  the valance 
sides and paint stripes on it (that was done on the vintage  one!).  Then if I 
feel really ambitious, I may cut a wavy edge on the  valance (or leave it 
straight) and sew on some cotton bullion edging.
 
Did I say cheap?  Here's my estimate based on materials  gathered:
 
Tarp:  22.00   (rubberized version is $20, I  think)
3" masking tape:  6.95
Paint:  1.00 ("oops" item returned to Home Depot then resold at  
discount--aclyd [acrylic] exterior paint)
Cheap foam paint brush:  .50
Grommets:  2.00 (already own grommet tools, fwiw)
3 steel telescoping tent poles (at 8.00 each):  24.00
thread, rope, reinforcing material, stake out line, tent stakes etc. will  be 
scavenged from stuff I already own.
 
Optional items I may add in:
Dye it a fun color:  about $5.00
Wash-in water repellant (2 bottles at 10):  20.00
 
4 steel ridge poles (at 22.00 each):  88.00 (for lateral  reinforcements)

11 yards cotton 3" bullion fringe (so far, see for best price  $3/yard):  
33.00 
 
So, my basic option is only $56.45!  Plus, since the  tarp came with felled 
seams, all I have to do is sew the valance,  reinforcements and rope 
edge--painting on the stripes will be the only  labor intensive job.  For $5 more, I can 
pre-dye it a fun color with a  handy package of rit dye.  I will probably 
also run it  through the machine with a bit of wash-in (nikwax) water repellant.  
I  am not sure about using the ridge poles for reenforcement ones since they  
are so expensive (yes, I am cheap)--so I think I'll try it without them at  
first.  The bullion trim may be my downfall though.  It would look so  neat 
with a nice fringe and wavy valance!  
 
Mary 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 11:02:13 -0400
From: "Ron Ainsworth" <rainsworth8@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #288

Mary, you have just solved a problem we have been toying with.

We have a Carefree on our 1972 that needs to have the awning material
changed after 32 years. The canvas is a great idea. How big is that canvas
you bought?

Ron & Barbara Ainsworth
'72 Ambassador International 29'
The Land Yatch Gen. Forrest
Rome, Ga.

- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: <MaryDotson@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
To: <valist@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2004 10:40 AM
Subject: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #288


> Thanks to all for the suggestions on the interior paint removal and the
> upper cabinets.  I will be doing a work weekend on our darlin' toaster
this
> weekend, so I will report back about the results.
>
> As for awning, we have a similar case of  former zipdeeitis.  I am going
to
> go the dirt cheap and lazy way,  since spening $500+ for a custom job is
just
> too much for a  rather optional item.
>
> At Home Depot, I bought two painters tarps (plan to use  only one--keep
the
> other for paint removal inside).  Most tarps there  are heavy rough
canvas, but
> the ones I bought are both white, of a  lighter weight but finer grade
> canvas.  My biggest choice is picking which  one--one is backed with
rubber.
> However, having looked at a vintage awning  (belonging to a friend who has
a canned
> ham) the not-backed one feels like the  vintage one.  I opened the cloth
one
> up--and to my delight I found that  they flat felled the seams joining the
> selvages of the fabric!  However,  there was also a big dirty footprint in
the
> middle, so I'm planning to wash it  (anyhow, it needs to be pre-shrunk).
Then I
> plan to sew a piece of rope  into the end, like welting or piping.  In the
> vintage ones, this fit into  the awning channel. For poles, I have ordered
a
> bunch of retractable poles  from _www.campmor.com_
(http://www.campmor.com) .  I
> will sew a  bit of heavier canvas at the stake-out points as
reinforcement,
> then pound in  big brass grommets for pole insertion at those points.
>
>  I'll also seam a channel in the front and sides (leaving a bit  to flop
down
> as valance), to insert lateral reinforcement poles (in the vintage  one,
this
> stoped it from slumping down at the sides).  Then I will miter  the
valance
> sides and paint stripes on it (that was done on the vintage  one!).  Then
if I
> feel really ambitious, I may cut a wavy edge on the  valance (or leave it
> straight) and sew on some cotton bullion edging.
>
> Did I say cheap?  Here's my estimate based on materials  gathered:
>
> Tarp:  22.00   (rubberized version is $20, I  think)
> 3" masking tape:  6.95
> Paint:  1.00 ("oops" item returned to Home Depot then resold at
> discount--aclyd [acrylic] exterior paint)
> Cheap foam paint brush:  .50
> Grommets:  2.00 (already own grommet tools, fwiw)
> 3 steel telescoping tent poles (at 8.00 each):  24.00
> thread, rope, reinforcing material, stake out line, tent stakes etc. will
be
> scavenged from stuff I already own.
>
> Optional items I may add in:
> Dye it a fun color:  about $5.00
> Wash-in water repellant (2 bottles at 10):  20.00
>
> 4 steel ridge poles (at 22.00 each):  88.00 (for lateral  reinforcements)
>
> 11 yards cotton 3" bullion fringe (so far, see for best price  $3/yard):
> 33.00
>
> So, my basic option is only $56.45!  Plus, since the  tarp came with
felled
> seams, all I have to do is sew the valance,  reinforcements and rope
> edge--painting on the stripes will be the only  labor intensive job.  For
$5 more, I can
> pre-dye it a fun color with a  handy package of rit dye.  I will probably
> also run it  through the machine with a bit of wash-in (nikwax) water
repellant.
> I  am not sure about using the ridge poles for reenforcement ones since
they
> are so expensive (yes, I am cheap)--so I think I'll try it without them at
> first.  The bullion trim may be my downfall though.  It would look so
neat
> with a nice fringe and wavy valance!
>
> Mary
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text
>
> To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
> http://www.tompatterson.com/VAC/VAList/listoffice.html

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 13:03:58 -0400
From: "Mr. Joy H. Hansen" <joytbrew@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: [VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .

Hi All,

Need some information about a '73 Airstream '27 foot that I hope the VAlist
can provide.  I leave in the morning to inspect the unit and need some
information.

First, is this the year/length that is involved with the rear sag?  I looked
at a '70 of the same length and the rear floor was gone and the expected
moving bumper was evident.  Also, up at the wheel well, there was a
significant buckle on the street  side and a slight buckle on the curb side.
I'm hoping that Airstream got it right by '73?  Hope I don't have to walk
away from the '73 as I did with the '70.  An inexperienced buyer of the '70
may want to salvage rather than restore as the damage is extensive.

Second, the bathroom floor is missing in the '73 and I have considerable
experience with my '69 Safari floor replacement.  However, my '74 Argosy has
a different means of attachment of the shell to the frame than the '69
Safari.  The Safari has the floor pinched between the cross frame and the
monocoque along with the bumper hatch shelf that directs water into the
floor and .  .  . disaster.  The Argosy has the monocoque connected directly
to the frame and the bath floor rests on a cross member in front of the
monocoque/frame connection.  Simplifies floor restoration as frame
separation isn't an issue.  This said, what's the consensus about bolt rivet
replacement to ensure that frame separation won't occur.

Third,  the holding tanks seem to be running parallel to the main frame
rails.  I seem to recall seeing pictures of floor restoration with this
arrangement.  Are the holding tank shrouds subject to the same deterioration
as in my Safari?

Fourth,  With the floor completely rotted out across the rear and under the
commode, what is the list's opinion of frame/cross member deterioration?
Seems that the floor may have been saturated from a leaking commode
valve/plumbing.  Seems probable that there was freeze damage that I'll have
to inspect.

The unit doesn't have a battery, making it difficult to check out the
seller's statement of the operational aspects of accessories.  I'll try to
use my emergency truck starting battery pack for the purpose.  Hopefully
this is OK?

Sure appreciate any information the list thinks might be valuable in
assessment of the restorability of this unit.

                     Regards, '69 Safari, Joy

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 14:05:22 -0400
From: "Jim Combs" <jimcombs@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Subject: RE: [VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .

From: Mr. Joy H. Hansen [mailto:joytbrew@xxxxxxxxxx.net] 

[snip]
>Second, the bathroom floor is missing in the '73 and I have considerable
>experience with my '69 Safari floor replacement.  However, my '74 Argosy
has
>a different means of attachment of the shell to the frame than the '69
>Safari.  The Safari has the floor pinched between the cross frame and the
>monocoque along with the bumper hatch shelf that directs water into the
>floor and .  .  . disaster.  

If I follow your description correctly, expect the '73 to 
be like your Safari.  My '76 rear bath is that way.

>Third,  the holding tanks seem to be running parallel to the main frame
>rails.  I seem to recall seeing pictures of floor restoration with this
>arrangement.  Are the holding tank shrouds subject to the same
deterioration
>as in my Safari?
>
>Fourth,  With the floor completely rotted out across the rear and under the
>commode, what is the list's opinion of frame/cross member deterioration?
>Seems that the floor may have been saturated from a leaking commode
>valve/plumbing.  Seems probable that there was freeze damage that I'll have
>to inspect.

My bathroom floor was severely rotted.  I removed all the fixtures, 
and the entire bathroom floor (~ 4'x8' sheet).  Also removed the 
holding tanks and repaired a minor area of the framework that had 
rusted away.  Pulled and banged out the dents in the 'banana' 
panels too.

I replaced the floor in 3 pieces as it had to be slipped into the 
perimeter channel that connects the shell, frame, and floor.  The 
two seems sit on top of the main rails of the ladder frame.

I've got pictures taken throughout the teardown all the way to 
where looking down you see nothing but dirt and grass.  The pics 
aren't up on any web page tho.  I could email 'em to you if 
you'd like.  Let me know.  

Jimbo / '76 Sovereign 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 14:21:44 -0400
From: "Jim Combs" <jimcombs@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
Subject: RE: [VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .

- -----Original Message-----
From: Combs, Jim [NGD:2G54:EXCH] 

> I replaced the floor in 3 pieces as it had to be slipped into the 
> perimeter channel that connects the shell, frame, and floor.  The 
> two seems sit on top of the main rails of the ladder frame.

Let me correct myself here -- I should've written  "...it had to 
be slipped UNDER the perimeter channel..." -- not "slipped INTO".  

The U-channel sits on top of the plywood floor, which sits on 
top of the frame rails and outriggers.  

Jimbo / '76 Sovereign 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 12:34:31 -0700
From: Joann Wheatley <jwheatle@xxxxxxxxxx.edu>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: VAL Digest V1 #288

Great plan, Mary:
    Then, as soon as you're finished, I'll fly you out here and you can 
build me one. I'm sure the airfare will be less than my latest estimate 
for an awning and the room & board here are a bargain if you don't mind 
sleeping with a big black poodle on top of your feet and a giant 
Spinone on the floor by your bed (he talks in his sleep by the way). Of 
course, I'll have to buy a sewing machine for your use.....
Jo Ann
On 24, Jun 2004, at 7:40 AM, MaryDotson@xxxxxxxxxx.com wrote:

> Thanks to all for the suggestions on the interior paint removal and the
> upper cabinets.  I will be doing a work weekend on our darlin' toaster 
> this
> weekend, so I will report back about the results.
>
> As for awning, we have a similar case of  former zipdeeitis.  I am 
> going to
> go the dirt cheap and lazy way,  since spening $500+ for a custom job 
> is just
> too much for a  rather optional item.
>
> At Home Depot, I bought two painters tarps (plan to use  only 
> one--keep the
> other for paint removal inside).  Most tarps there  are heavy rough 
> canvas, but
> the ones I bought are both white, of a  lighter weight but finer grade
> canvas.  My biggest choice is picking which  one--one is backed with 
> rubber.
> However, having looked at a vintage awning  (belonging to a friend who 
> has a canned
> ham) the not-backed one feels like the  vintage one.  I opened the 
> cloth one
> up--and to my delight I found that  they flat felled the seams joining 
> the
> selvages of the fabric!  However,  there was also a big dirty 
> footprint in the
> middle, so I'm planning to wash it  (anyhow, it needs to be 
> pre-shrunk).  Then I
> plan to sew a piece of rope  into the end, like welting or piping.  In 
> the
> vintage ones, this fit into  the awning channel. For poles, I have 
> ordered a
> bunch of retractable poles  from _www.campmor.com_ 
> (http://www.campmor.com) .  I
> will sew a  bit of heavier canvas at the stake-out points as 
> reinforcement,
> then pound in  big brass grommets for pole insertion at those points.
>
>  I'll also seam a channel in the front and sides (leaving a bit  to 
> flop down
> as valance), to insert lateral reinforcement poles (in the vintage  
> one, this
> stoped it from slumping down at the sides).  Then I will miter  the 
> valance
> sides and paint stripes on it (that was done on the vintage  one!).  
> Then if I
> feel really ambitious, I may cut a wavy edge on the  valance (or leave 
> it
> straight) and sew on some cotton bullion edging.
>
> Did I say cheap?  Here's my estimate based on materials  gathered:
>
> Tarp:  22.00   (rubberized version is $20, I  think)
> 3" masking tape:  6.95
> Paint:  1.00 ("oops" item returned to Home Depot then resold at
> discount--aclyd [acrylic] exterior paint)
> Cheap foam paint brush:  .50
> Grommets:  2.00 (already own grommet tools, fwiw)
> 3 steel telescoping tent poles (at 8.00 each):  24.00
> thread, rope, reinforcing material, stake out line, tent stakes etc. 
> will  be
> scavenged from stuff I already own.
>
> Optional items I may add in:
> Dye it a fun color:  about $5.00
> Wash-in water repellant (2 bottles at 10):  20.00
>
> 4 steel ridge poles (at 22.00 each):  88.00 (for lateral  
> reinforcements)
>
> 11 yards cotton 3" bullion fringe (so far, see for best price  
> $3/yard):
> 33.00
>
> So, my basic option is only $56.45!  Plus, since the  tarp came with 
> felled
> seams, all I have to do is sew the valance,  reinforcements and rope
> edge--painting on the stripes will be the only  labor intensive job.  
> For $5 more, I can
> pre-dye it a fun color with a  handy package of rit dye.  I will 
> probably
> also run it  through the machine with a bit of wash-in (nikwax) water 
> repellant.
> I  am not sure about using the ridge poles for reenforcement ones 
> since they
> are so expensive (yes, I am cheap)--so I think I'll try it without 
> them at
> first.  The bullion trim may be my downfall though.  It would look so  
> neat
> with a nice fringe and wavy valance!
>
> Mary
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> When replying to a message. please delete all unnecessary original text
>
> To unsubscribe or change to a digest format, please go to
> http://www.tompatterson.com/VAC/VAList/listoffice.html

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 16:23:24 -0400
From: "Mr. Joy H. Hansen" <joytbrew@xxxxxxxxxx.net>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Airstream Quest Continued .  .  .

Thanks Jim,

It's unfortunate that Airstream didn't use the Argosy modification.  I
haven't changed out the rear floor in the Argosy as I've been using it while
I try to get the '69 Safari on the road.  Think I got too many allegators in
the pond to keep concentrated on the objective.  With the effort I put into
the Argosy, everything except the bath floor, I could have had the Safari on
the road long ago.  Then, I liked the dual axle so much that .  .  .

I'll ask you for specific pictures.  Possibly I saw some of your pictures
long ago?  Standing on the ground in what was the bath?

Do the tanks have a housing with insulation?  The Argosy seems to have
baffles rather than a housing and insulation as the Safari does.  Might have
to know what I'm getting into when I pull the belly off.  The frame repair
does worry me a bit, though I can do some gorilla welding.  Better than
trying to do the overhead bit as I did on the Safari skid rails, I hope.

Leave in the morning hauling the Argosy to Chimney Rock, NC.  On the way,
I'll stop by a gun shop and buy a Uberti 1873 Deluxe Border rifle in .45
Colt (a replica of course).  Then on the Chimney Rock for the inspection and
return to camp at Statesville, NC.  The Cowboy Action Shootin' starts in the
morning as the shootin' site is only a couple blocks from the KOA camp
ground. :)  Get to combine my two hobbies, CAS and Camping! :)

Well, I got to get back to packing the trailer and truck.  The hookup of the
Hensley was a piece of cake this day.

                                                  Regards, '69 Safari, Joy


- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Combs" <jimcombs@xxxxxxxxxx.com>
>
> My bathroom floor was severely rotted.  I removed all the fixtures,
> and the entire bathroom floor (~ 4'x8' sheet).  Also removed the
> holding tanks and repaired a minor area of the framework that had
> rusted away.
>
> I've got pictures taken throughout the teardown all the way to
> where looking down you see nothing but dirt and grass.  The pics

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 22:39:39 -0600
From: "Forrest" <forrest@xxxxxxxxxx.org>
Subject: Re: [VAL] Re: Door Hinge Question

On the '66 Overlander I just bought the door hinge pops loudly in a
ratcheting sound when I open or close it. I suspect that it is binding, and
so have oiled the hinge. The popping continues though. This is the single
center hinge style and the door closes and latches well. Has anyone
experienced this before, and how did you fix it?

Thanks,

Forrest

------------------------------

End of VAL Digest V1 #289
*************************


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